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Staff notes, Sunday May 12th

Staff Notes Cast apps Lore Roleplay

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#21 Core

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 12:13 AM

So do you feel like main RP should have no standards at all, or that free RP should require app approval?

 

Neither. Main roleplay having standards is what makes it so desirable, but Templar actually hit a key point of my own feelings: the "make the changes or go to FFA" is one of the main proponents of the negative stigma toward that area. Personally I feel as though a solution involving low-level staff members whose job solely revolves around making the Free-For-All area an amazing place to be would be wonderful, but it would be dependent on said effort from those individuals. Again, that would strengthen the link between staff and members, seeing that those who run the site want every area of the forum to be desirable, not relegated to tier lists of approval.





#22 Dessa

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 12:17 AM

Neither. Main roleplay having standards is what makes it so desirable, but Templar actually hit a key point of my own feelings: the "make the changes or go to FFA" is one of the main proponents of the negative stigma toward that area. Personally I feel as though a solution involving low-level staff members whose job solely revolves around making the Free-For-All area an amazing place to be would be wonderful, but it would be dependent on said effort from those individuals. Again, that would strengthen the link between staff and members, seeing that those who run the site want every area of the forum to be desirable, not relegated to tier lists of approval.

What would these staffers do, specifically?





#23 Core

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 12:21 AM

In my fantasy, their sole responsibilities would be toward helping those who had questions about Free-For-All, organizing large amazing threads that could include many people whilst showing that it can be just as fun as LoE, and more. They would not even need to be staff, honestly, but my belief is simply that a badge or title lends weight to one's words in initial conversations. Also, FFA might be cast in a more positive light if it was noticeable that staff were making strides to ensure its validity.



#24 Rainbow_Dash

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 05:44 AM

I'd fill up half a page with quotes, so I'm just going to say what I want without quoting anyone *derp*

 

I agree with all the opinions that FFA has a stigma to it, but at the same time I also agree that it's almost impossible to take away that stigma without it losing what's special.

 

I'm going to explain what the 1 thing I hate about FFA is, hopefully it will help others (or maybe I'm just insane) the fact that there is zero continuity and everyone is forced to make one-shot RPs that, when finished, will never have a sequil. (As opposed to the mane RP where everything is tied together) ---of course, even if continuity was allowed, it wouldn't help much because people would still see it as "well you failed in mane, so you go to FFA" Honestly, I cant think of any way to erase that stigma (except eliminating mane entirely, of course, and going pure-FFA, which would solve all problems at once)





#25 Dessa

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 07:27 AM

I've found the best way to make FFA work for GOOD rp is to simply take your favorite RPers there with you. 





#26 Rainbow_Dash

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 07:50 AM

I've found the best way to make FFA work for GOOD rp is to simply take your favorite RPers there with you.


Yeah, but its hard work dragging them there kicking and screaming...



#27 8bit-Icecube

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 07:52 AM

I'm going to explain what the 1 thing I hate about FFA is, hopefully it will help others (or maybe I'm just insane) the fact that there is zero continuity and everyone is forced to make one-shot RPs that, when finished, will never have a sequil. (As opposed to the mane RP where everything is tied together) ---of course, even if continuity was allowed, it wouldn't help much.....

 

:O WHA!??!? 

There's no continuity allowed in FFA!? What's this nonsense!

Is there really someone to stop me when I create a template world for FFA where-in I create several threads with several persons? Entwining the threads when appropriate? 

Does anyone have a problem if I have a good RP with someone and we then decide to get together for another thread with the same characters?

No continuity in FFA, pfft. Tis just what you make of it.





#28 Dessa

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 07:55 AM

People are absolutely free to set up their own mini RP worlds within free, and to apply any standard they wish.





#29 8bit-Icecube

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 08:02 AM

The staff on this site will allow me to do my thing here. Wouldn't they?  8D

 

On that sidenote; Was planning something like that in the near future. But how pony must it be? ._.





#30 Templar_Frost

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 09:58 AM

Honestly, I cant think of any way to erase that stigma (except eliminating mane entirely, of course, and going pure-FFA, which would solve all problems at once)

 

Well perhaps you are right, there will always be a stigma towards FFA. But the how bad the stigma might be towards the community can still vary. For instance, it will help if...

 

Staffers don't tell you multiple times to go there. I get the first time, as sort of a "heads up" or an awareness to the apper. And sure, if they are having trouble, it would be cool to remind them. But, don't tell them over and over again to go to FFA. Like, repetitively  Guess where I seen this before? (Heck sometimes I even see a request to go to FFA twice in one post). Staff should try to avoid doing that, because one thing you don't want to occur... is that you convey to the apper that you want his/her app to go to FFA, much more than actually helping the person to the Mane RP. Also, what does not help, is assuming that a certain character is for FFA, Then telling them. No, not the "better suited for FFA" deal, that can be fine. I mean directly telling somebody who is apping for Mane RP, that it's an FFA app. 





#31 Khajiit

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 11:24 AM

Now, let's advance. I don't know where the vibe that you can't have continuity in the FFA came from. As long as everything is done along the rules, you should be fine doing whatever you like with whoever you like. I've seen dozens of threads where people continued their stories from the past or interacted with same characters in a way they knew each other for long already. What you do with FFA is purely up to you and your ability to organize the RP. In fact, it doesn't differ from LoE that much, since in LoE if you want to have a really big, quality RP ongoing, you need to plan and organize it as well. One-shots can lead you at most to some typical RP's which only differ in post length.

 

As for staff telling to go to FFA. From my experience and what I've seen in apps, this mostly happened if either application was so feathering derped that it would be extremely hard to fix it, though even then quite often there was an offer of making it WoE applicable. But mainly what I saw is a person somehow resisting the changes suggested and trying to force their ideas into the Mane RP regardless. That's where I find FFA suggestions completely understandable. I will not say that I've read every single app, but in those which I've read everything seemed, usually, fine for me. That's how I see it and I am not going to discuss it.


Edited by Dessa, 14 May 2013 - 11:26 PM.
Removed off-topic talk due to thread split




#32 Davroth

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 02:43 PM

I said it before, and I'll say it again. I don't want ban the subject of Canterlot from this board, but we are walking a very narrow path right now, the way we talk about them. Please be mindful of that when you decide to discuss that board.


As for FFA, I'm not sure we really cam make it more attractive. The iniative needs to come from the players themselves, otherwise we are basically not have one moderated RP section, but two at once. It would mean double duty for the staff, and I don't think that's very fair towards them. Plus, I think the dedication to our central RP section would suffer if we have to put similar work into the FFA section, too.





#33 Core

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 03:11 PM

I do not think anyone is necessarily asking for FFA to equal LoE in terms of staff attention and dedication. While the supposed allure of the area is to truly do what you want, its unmoderated nature does tend to lead it toward a laissez-faire attitude from its players. Many of the "talented" roleplayers are seen striving to join the mane roleplay with its strict requirements, as it tests their creativity within defined limits, whilst those who cannot are left to do whatever they so choose. All things said, it is almost akin to applying to your favorite institution and receiving a letter stating that you are not quite good enough to join those you idolize. Why should they roleplay ponies and offer their unique viewpoints when they can just as easily claim to be an oni in a Darth Vader outfit that pulled Equestria through a black hole?

A thought occurred to me: Free-For-All is similar to Australia. There are those who go there for supposed freedom and beauty, and those who remember that it received many thousands of inhabitants because British undesirables were abandoned there. Both are valid viewpoints, if you think about it.

With as much modesty as I can muster, I have been told that I can be a fairly accomplished roleplayer and thus I will mainly keep to the FFA section myself, attempting to share what I have learned with those who would see it be a thriving section of its own accord. The freedom to play spirits and leviathans is tempting as well. As you have said, the staff need to focus on the mane roleplay to ensure it maintains the standards required of the top-tier roleplay environment.


Edited by Dessa, 14 May 2013 - 11:27 PM.
Removed off-topic talk due to thread split




#34 Rainbow_Dash

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 03:54 PM

I do not think anyone is necessarily asking for FFA to equal LoE in terms of staff attention and dedication. While the supposed allure of the area is to truly do what you want, its unmoderated nature does tend to lead it toward a laissez-faire attitude from its players. Many of the "talented" roleplayers are seen striving to join the mane roleplay with its strict requirements, as it tests their creativity within defined limits, whilst those who cannot are left to do whatever they so choose. All things said, it is almost akin to applying to your favorite institution and receiving a letter stating that you are not quite good enough to join those you idolize. Why should they roleplay ponies and offer their unique viewpoints when they can just as easily claim to be an oni in a Darth Vader outfit that pulled Equestria through a black hole?

 
I hate to be the voice of reason here, but this has been said many times so far and everyone agreed, I have the feeling that this discussion in going in circles...
 
Basically we all agree that the current viewpoint is that Mane is the "gold standard" and FFA is the "losers who cant get into mane" (even though that's not the case at all, honestly I expect I'll spend quite a bit of time in FFA even if I get Cast characters in mane because FFA is DESIGNED to allow you to severely alter canon to allow exparimentation with "What if...?" ides) Stating a problem over and over meerly boosts post count, solutions should be thought up. Though personally I rather doubt there can really be one since by nature we tend to classify things into 'tiers' so there will always be a 'bottom tier' no matter how hard we try to eliminate it.
 

The freedom to play spirits and leviathans is tempting as well.


Oh I am SO doing a FFA RP with Starswirl's Ghost ;)





#35 Core

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 04:00 PM

I have the feeling that this discussion in going in circles...


Welcome to the cycle.

I attempt further clarification each time, I apologize if I am unclear.





#36 Rainbow_Dash

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 04:03 PM

Welcome to the cycle.

I attempt further clarification each time, I apologize if I am unclear.

 

I also apologize, re-reading what I said I think I stepped out of bounds there with what I said.





#37 Core

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 04:09 PM

No apologies necessary, as far as I am aware this still remains a thread of discussion and open ideas and you were merely voicing your own. I do appreciate what the staff is doing here. Nothing has gotten vindictive or accusatory, and while it may be an argument it is in the pursuit of the betterment of Whitetail Woods.





#38 8bit-Icecube

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 09:41 PM

Aaand that's the end of the offtopic topic how superly awesome and overwhelming sweet Canterlot actually is... or isn't.

Back to the discussion, how to handle the FFA section and Main cast applications!
I rather have nothing new to post.... so let's recap the vibe that I got!
How about.. (we mostly did this already).. we just set up general post quality rules. Like, no 'one sentence'-reply, a little engaging etc. That also holds for the Main. Let the creator of an FFA thread decide for the rules and setting for his or her thread. But also request for a quality level, which he/she then upholds by helping the participants reach the desired quality. 

Everyone else, and mostly the staff, should never even think of the FFA-section as 'less'.

And indeed, as done before, the over the top applications that just don't fit into Main can be handled by:encouraging to create more background and setting, so they can successfully make a thread in the FFA. Getting joined by other people who are interesting in the initial twist. BUT I'd love to see that most threads in FFA just be awesome ideas that doesn't stroke with the normal Equestria world.

 

Finishing this post with a question.

How little pony may a thread contain? Talking about just stepping into a different setting, different world, with a void of anything Equestrian. (In the FFA)





#39 Khajiit

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 10:02 PM

It was just a heads up Templar, I don't know why you treat this as some kind of personal assault. *Shrugs* You need to ease the tension.

 

What I can say about this site, is that it is not Canterlot's younger brother/sister/whatever and it's not going to prosper under its shadow. Canterlot will influence us only to an extent to which we as a community, including you, allow ourselves to. Although I find it somewhat funny that it's so easy for many people to talk about what Canterlot did wrong and "warn" others about it, but so rarely I will see somebody saying "Yeah that was great on Canterlot, we should totally do it." Like the rules you've just mentioned. They're fine, they work, so they're adapted. Canterlot doesn't have any copyrights for their rules after all. You cannot avoid similarities.

 

 

Anyway, how little pony...? Everyone are always arguing how stuff has not enough pony. You're going the wrong way 8bit. But well, it is a pony site. If you want to do a non-pony RP, why do it here where there are dozens of better websites which can offer a canon which will give you far greater possibilities to work with?

 

As for mane cast... well I've stated my opinion already ._. Guess I'd like staff to internally discuss it now and come up with proposition now. (Also, NO to users voting who should get cast or multi-cast-roleplaying. That second one gives no possibilities of maintaining continuity)





#40 Core

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Posted 14 May 2013 - 10:06 PM

Well, it is Free-For-All. Does that not mean they can roleplay nearly anything (within PG limits)?









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